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Post by djgirlcherise on Jan 14, 2006 15:29:13 GMT -5
You live in a bubble if you think animals are not tortured every single day so that you can eat meat. It's the lowest common denominator in humans.
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Post by nimue on Jan 14, 2006 15:33:36 GMT -5
Why do we have to visualize anything specific? Can't we just picture a wave of light sweeping over the world, affecting everyone and everything?
Debating what things should take priority is a recipe for disaster- different people have different values.
As for the herbivore vs. omnivore debate, I understand both sides. After judging my own values, I realized that I don't agree with mass slaughter, but I see nothing wrong with killing and consuming animals. We are not disrespecting them. Humans have evolved to eat meat, and as long us we don't cause exessive pain, I don't see anything wrong with us doing so. If anything, I would prefer everyone to work for our meat. That is to say, I wish all of us would have to hunt for it ourselves. However, our bodies are built to eat meat, like many other animals on this planet, and there is nothing wrong with that.
Love and light,
Nimue
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Post by radaeron on Jan 14, 2006 15:41:39 GMT -5
You live in a bubble if you think animals are not tortured every single day so that you can eat meat. It's the lowest common denominator in humans. Being bluntly honest. If that is the entire sum of your response I think it's best I follow my gut feeling.
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Post by djgirlcherise on Jan 14, 2006 16:06:01 GMT -5
See you on the other side, if you ever want to get there.
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phantomx
Awakened
In all my life, in all my fantasy books, I could never have imagined what I am today...
Posts: 58
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Post by phantomx on Jan 14, 2006 16:28:00 GMT -5
With the meditations, I think we should imagine a massive becon of light coming from us to the heavens, then moving outward as far as you can go.
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phantomx
Awakened
In all my life, in all my fantasy books, I could never have imagined what I am today...
Posts: 58
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Post by phantomx on Jan 14, 2006 16:34:58 GMT -5
As for the other debate, I just want to say that you are both right. Humans need to eat meat sparingly, and more veggies. But with all these protien diets, the demand has become more and more. We need to stop thinking about what we look like and start caring about others. I understand if you are extremly overweight and need the diets. Eat away to survive, the rest of us can cut out huge stake dinners for ya.
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deedee
Awakened
"It takes a fool to remain sane, in this world all covered up in shame"
Posts: 82
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Post by deedee on Jan 14, 2006 17:05:41 GMT -5
Rad: "Cows are placed with their head on the ground and a bolt is fired into the head, killing it instantly." you're only talking abot the last seconds in the life of a cow! what about all the years they spend chained tightly so that they even can't turn around? is that natural? web.telia.com/~u65014871/images2/vy.jpg and what about 98 per cent of all pigs that don't even get to see the sun before the day of slaughter? is that worth the taste of pork? broiler chickens grow so fast that most of them have deformed legs making their short life miserable. "Millions of birds go lame in the latter part of their short lives – their legs unable to support their meaty bodies. Each year millions more die of heart and lung problems connected with their huge demand for oxygen to fuel their rapid growth." is that humane? whether you want it or not animal suffering is the consequence of eating meat.
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Post by nimue on Jan 14, 2006 17:19:46 GMT -5
I don't mean to be insensitive, but could we possibly start another topic for that debate?
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Post by Dimensional Leaf on Jan 14, 2006 17:24:34 GMT -5
I agree with Nimue, this conversation is worthy attention, however, also its own thread.
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Post by Dimensional Leaf on Jan 14, 2006 17:28:52 GMT -5
Please observe that everyone speak from different understandings. Each level of truth is unknowable to the levels below it. Listen to dear Nimue. It certainly is a step towards failure if we can't see past our conditioning, which are not better or worse, only different. No one is guilty of there beliefs. If we want to make something of this experiment, we must love eachother without reason, and I mean it. We must be love to see it. I agree with you Cherise that we can't ask from others what we wouldn't do ourselves. I would also want people to stop eating animals, but at the moment I accept it isn't that way. I thought that we before we start the main visualization (spelling?) we will all unite on a specific place, perhaps over the atlantic ocean, feel eachother and know that we are in this together. We are strong and light, a ball of energy with potential. The visualization does not have to be complicated at all, but it has to contain some details we can take to us to make it appear more vidid, because that will lead to more faith. Also I think it would be good if we could hold it for half an hour at least. With time we can make this more advanced and so on, but the first time I reckon we ought to keep it simple and within reach. "With the meditations, I think we should imagine a massive becon of light coming from us to the he avens, then moving outward as far as you can go. " "Why do we have to visualize anything specific? Can't we just picture a wave of light sweeping over the world, affecting everyone and everything? " Great Phantomx and Nimue. To make it clear to everyone I think we need some pictures that everyone can start from. Please post if you have any that can make a clear image of our intention, which will grow along them. Here's one we might want to use: www.nickyee.com/photoshop/earth-atlantic-1600.jpg
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Post by radaeron on Jan 14, 2006 17:30:40 GMT -5
A few things I want to clear up: - I don't encourage the captive lives of animals. I'd rather they ran free. - I don't eat pork so I have no guilt about that. - I'm just taking the realistic approach. Things aren't just going to change with the click of a finger. I can't help why things are what they are -right now-. I was born into this civilisation. I am not in any position to change animal law. So I just refuse to feel guilty about something I can't help. - A lot of the world enjoys its meat, and I'm afraid you'd have a hard time to convince them to give up their turkey sandwiches.
Furthermore, I'm sorry if I seem aggressive, but I feel very strongly I'm being put on the stand for something that ISN'T MY FAULT. I have no reason to be on the defensive. So don't try to put me on it. I just refuse.
A last point I'd like to give to this thread, consider availability of food. Third world countries. Where children go starving. Would you deny them meat, even if it was bred for the slaughter, if it was the only food available?
I consider the suffering of humans greater than the suffering of seemingly mindless animal. If you help a child starved of food, they could grow into a powerful figure who could change the world. If you help a cow out of captivity. It could perhaps eat a few tonnes more of grass in its lifetime before laying to rest.
To highlight again, I'm just being realistic and stating my views. I will say this too, just because I feel like I was attacked, if you don't like my views. I couldn't care less. Nothing you say will change them. I don't honestly care at all if you don't like them! Just ACCEPT them as my views instead of pulling a knife on me!
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Post by Dimensional Leaf on Jan 14, 2006 17:32:08 GMT -5
James, please in another thread. Thank you
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Post by radaeron on Jan 14, 2006 17:33:10 GMT -5
Relax Leaf, I'm done with that topic. That was just my closing statement on the matter.
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Post by djgirlcherise on Jan 15, 2006 0:34:35 GMT -5
Hi 10 Leaf,
I love the picture. I'm still for the idea of participating in the first group positive meditation. I would like to participate if the first one is for us.
We should each document our personal experience and results here.
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Post by thecrystalmaiden on Jan 15, 2006 1:10:05 GMT -5
I'm in Southern California, count me in.
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Post by thecrystalmaiden on Jan 15, 2006 1:20:46 GMT -5
Oh, and everyone, please remain respectful to one another. =) I love how this board resolves issues so quickly.
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Post by waterjag on Jan 15, 2006 5:23:51 GMT -5
My views on a large mediation session, for a topic are related to what I have been thinking about recently, that is 'politics' namely, what it is in my understanding politics is. I have gone only so far as to repeating the mantra politics over and over again (making sure no-one is in close proximity at the time) and talking to someone about it. I'm just going to talk to someone else about it. I'll be right back. They all say it is too early in the morning. Anyways, the person I talked to commented how money is wasted in lousy planning, so I was thinking of energy conservation as being in same way helpful in making the planet all good 'feng shui' or something like that (there is a hawaiian version as well). What I meant by energy conservation is that there is a lot of it around and people need to plan carffully on how to use, so maybe more simply my message is
for people to have more care and planning in how they recieve things and construct things.
p.s. So there isn't anything that goes to waste, like having traffic lights instead of a roundabout because someone didn't think correctly. The story behind that goes if you want to do a U-turn, you can't at a traffic light, because there is a long road ahead, but if you have a roundabout than it's easier to do a U-turn
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Post by muirrin on Jan 15, 2006 9:09:17 GMT -5
"for people to have more care and planning in how they recieve things and construct things."
Best suggestion I've seen so far, because this can extend into all aspects of life.
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Post by gemma on Jan 15, 2006 13:54:45 GMT -5
I'd like to join too!! I am from Hungary (Mid-Europe)... what will be my time?
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Post by radaeron on Jan 15, 2006 13:59:24 GMT -5
I think Hungary is +2 hours onto GMT..
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Post by Dimensional Leaf on Jan 15, 2006 14:30:35 GMT -5
What about this?
"You must learn to embrace your wonderful power and abilities. And avoid the defeatism and idea your responsibility is nil or nothing. You ALL are responsible. Many peoples are choosing to leave the earth. For they have no faith. We give you faith. We provide you with power. You who take no advantage of this power are sorely disappointing to us. We need your power with our power. We need all to spread this message to any gathering where there are ears to listen, minds to think, bodies to take action to carry this message forward. And this is how it will work to save this planet earth.
Earth is a very important link in the chain of development of the Universe. Your scientists are recognizing with their Quantum Theory a truth your Spiritual Masters have long taught - thoughts affect Matter. We tell you that your thoughts affect more than matter, your thoughts affect EVERYTHING. We tell you that there is present now an imbalance of energies in the earth. This is due to the focus of many on the negative aspects of your experiences in this plane of existence. This focus can be, must be, changed. It is possible with the use of the vibrations of Light.
How can we tell you more of the energy and the power you have with Light? Is not laser surgery a powerful demonstration of what Light can do when it is focused and concentrated? And you have minds to use to focus and concentrate this energy. Such energy can raise the vibrations of this planet and of every life form upon it. If all on planet earth want to live a happy and healthy life and if planet earth is to remain hospitable to human life, focus on the Light.
It is so simple and it is so powerful. Do NOT imagine what you wish the Light to do. Do NOT focus it on the evil or the darkness. Simply focus on the Light. Let the Lightás healing vibrations lift the planet, and the life forms upon it, to their proper balance. "
-http://www.odysseyofthesoul.org/proclamation.html
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Post by Sáille on Jan 15, 2006 14:38:37 GMT -5
Wow, that proclamation is currently tingling in my soul. I want to do that!
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Post by djgirlcherise on Jan 15, 2006 19:59:17 GMT -5
That's a very encouraging meditation, and I participate with all my light. Forever and ever.
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Post by Shaelyn on Jan 15, 2006 21:32:42 GMT -5
"avoid the defeatism..."
that's something that took me a long time to learn...and somehow many of the people I'm drawn to haven't learned this themselves.
I would love to meditate on that.
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Post by muirrin on Jan 16, 2006 20:57:50 GMT -5
I like that too...
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Post by Shaelyn on Jan 17, 2006 2:13:50 GMT -5
to add to that...this morning, I woke up, and I thought of two words, and I thought, hey--that would be a great hook/title for a song. ...I was going to write it down at the end of my song journal...but when I opened journal, what I had jotted down on the page I was immediately turned to fit those two words so well. ...and I think it sums up that quote reasonably well too...at least, the first paragraph...and if not, I like it anyway lol.
"Liberate Yourself"
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Post by Dimensional Leaf on Jan 18, 2006 3:58:52 GMT -5
So, is everyone OK with this meditation? Is the timetable OK for this weekend, or should we push it forward/back?
Love
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Post by muirrin on Jan 18, 2006 7:30:57 GMT -5
Weekend sounds great to me... I'm going to the coast and staying overnight tomorrow, then going out with friends Friday, so I'm pretty sure I'll have nothing on Saturday/Sunday
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Post by Sáille on Jan 18, 2006 7:40:51 GMT -5
What were the times again? Weekend sounds good to me too.
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Post by Uriah on Jan 18, 2006 9:04:48 GMT -5
I'm flexible but it sounds good to me. I think we should do the meditation on each other first. Uniting us and giving each other strength. I think it will bond us and strengthen our intentions for each subsequent meditation.
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