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Post by radaeron on May 11, 2006 12:19:35 GMT -5
[Quick summary of situation before venting from my LJ] Ok, I met this girl, I developed a crush for her, and I was plucking up courage to find out how she feels.
[The rant] I have at least saved time by finding out how she feels. Obviously it was a fat "D-Nied" Followed by its happy sidekick "I hope we can still be friends"
!!Any woman that reads this!! Why oh why do you hope you can still be friends with someone after you just shot them right out of the sky? Is it to test how spineless we are? To see if we'll hang around to watch the cake knowing we'll never eat the cake? Is it just so you don't feel so bad about having brought down the cleaver of rejection onto some poor sod's bare neck of expressing his feelings? Do you think we don't have friends of our own we'd like to be around? I mean I think the idea of hanging out with people I know is preferable to hanging around someone with the constant reminder of "Hah! You didn't get with that!"... Call me crazy but I think I'll take the former.
Now that the open question is out of the way..
It makes me think of the nice guy theory. Which has been proved countless numbers of times. Women don't want nice guys [No matter how much they say they do]. They want bullies and thugs. I think often of the saying "Nice guys finish last." And I don't find any comfort in it. Infact I put forward frequently: Do nice guys even FINISH? In my experience [Albeit only 17 years] no. No they do NOT!
Suffice to say. I do not intend to hang around her often [See cake metaphor]. And hope I can just get on with things without my thoughts clouded. In all likelihood this will, unfortunately, not happen.
... Ugh.
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Post by Sáille on May 11, 2006 12:30:05 GMT -5
Awww honey... *huggles* You know, you did make me giggle when I read the thing that came right after "!!Any woman that reads this!!", and when I read the "happy sidekick" bit. But the subject is just saaaaad and I completely and utterly want to huggle you to death. ^-^
Anyways, before I get carried away. An answer to your question. ;D If I ever reject guys (which I have done before, but very very gently) I won't offer friendship. If they still want to hang out with me, then that is okay too. But I think, like you, that it is just cruel to leave the guy hanging by the little threads of what they could've had if I had just loved them back.
I do, however, love it when they express their feelings. Even if it isn't mutual. Because I am so perceptive, I easily notice it when someone likes me a whole lot... and usually I wait for them to come to me with it (one of my bad habits). I don't like it when guys keep everything to themselves and pretend that they haven't got a crush on me. I love honesty. ^-^ And I tell them so, even when I reject them in a pretty gentle way.
I actually want a nice guy. I have no love for thugs or bullies, nor have I got any love for agression or obnoxious comments. I love a plain simple down-to-earth nice guy who knows how to use his brain and who accepts people for who they are. Nice guys finish first in my world.
But that's just me, I suppose. ;D
*another big huggle*
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Post by radaeron on May 11, 2006 12:53:31 GMT -5
Wouldn't surprise me if it did make people giggle. I have a strange sense of humour at my own misfortune. Alth, I definately think your way is the best. Why offer friendship? It truly is the laaast thing we want to hear. And I still don't believe you when you say you want a nice guy Because all the weird people and tough people and mean people I know more often than not have girlfriends. I know loads of nice guys. And one. One. Has a girlfriend. Perhaps there are exceptions to the rule. I'll be happy when I find mine ¬__¬ But thanks for the huggles ^_^;; I just had to vent a bit, and its nice that people even read it ya know.
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Post by muirrin on May 11, 2006 15:03:53 GMT -5
Hey, I like nice guys too, whether you believe it or not! It's definitely better than being seen as a fashion accessory and/or being abused and/or watching other people being abused and having to laugh since it's your boyfriend doing it and/or being subjected to bad influences... etc etc.
But I know that most girls will go through a craze where it always is the bad boy... and you're right, no matter how much they say they like nice guys, they will always choose the bad boy. I guess it's just a time of experimentation and excitement for them... but the time does come when they will settle down with a nice bloke. I personally don't understand why we can't just have nice blokes to begin with but anyways, I was never going to be "normal" I don't think.
The thing is, girls will reject you but offer friendship in the hope of softening the blow. Our way of thinking is that if you can't have us in the way you want then maybe having a part of us will make you feel a little bit better. I guess I can't speak for most girls but when it comes to friends of mine (and me, occasionally) we can't understand why most males can never be friends, because that's all we genuinely want!
I guess you're the only one who can suss out this girl's emotions... but I'm sorry about what happened *hugs* ... personally, I tend to wait for the first advances of friendship in any situation, so I don't see why it would be any different for this.
Like Alth, I respect the honesty, especially since I know I never have the guts to make the first move.
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Post by radaeron on May 11, 2006 15:59:01 GMT -5
"I guess you're the only one who can suss out this girl's emotions." How I wish that was true I'm no good when it comes to all this kind of stuff. I've been talking to a good few people today though. Trying to get different perspectives. Don't know where to go from here. Don't know whether to stay friends. Hrm. If she's being honest, I'll be wasting my time. If she's playing games, I want nothing to do with it.
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Post by musicman on May 11, 2006 16:40:22 GMT -5
Rad, don't ever try to figure out women. The best relationship results from that. This is the best advice I was ever told. Everybody is different. The important lesson to learn here is to let things be, and take things at a first and foremost level, acting on facts rather than assumptions. I think the only real understanding people have between each other is solid evidence of what is said or actually happens. There's so many ways to look at things, so many ways to take things, you'll go nuts if you try to figure it all out, especially if you ask her something and she isn't honest with you to cover up an insecure feeling.
I really think that people are way too giving to each other. You may say "Huh?" to this but, if not in a balance, people try rationalize things in a paranoid way. They look at the opposite reaction of the unseen action. You'll start to rationalize things against yourself, and think that most people are against you, when really, all they're trying to do is help. One way you can avoid this is by asking yourself, why would she want to hurt me? Who am i? If you're nobody, your ego will drop most assuradely and you won't wonder about these things.
Don't take this the wrong way, but ego plays a big role in relationships. Thinking, only I can do this for you, is quite egoish. Thinking about yourself wanting or needing somebody else does not bring you happiness. It only takes away from you. I think it's best to say, when it's the right time, it will happen.
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Post by thecrystalmaiden on May 11, 2006 18:44:25 GMT -5
Well dude, the reason why we say "we can still be friends" is because girls have that amazing ability to be friends with a guy and never once think about him sexually or romantically in any way, and about six months ago I thought guys were exactly the same as we are, but then I realized it just wasn't so. When a girl says "I hope we can still be friends" what she means to say is "I hope it doesn't get awkward between us, because I hate feeling awkward around people." When girls interact with each other, they don't speak directly because the other girl might see it as rude, this leads back to girls preferring small friend groups rather than playing in larger, more competitive groups like guys, so instead they say things like "I hope we can still be friends" to subtly hint to the other girl that "I hope there's no confrontation between us." They don't think about the fact that guys usually don't hint to each other in this way, it's really a girl language, so when girls say that go guys, the guy ends up feeling like the girl pitties him or the other various reasons you listed. As for the nice guy thing - it's not that girls want assholes and not "nice guys", it's that YOUNG girls are more attracted to assholes because the asshole always makes them feel special by being a [censored word] to everyone else while being nice to the girl. Obviously this still means the guy's a [censored word], but it makes the girl feel like she's with the strong and confident guy, I'm speaking from my own experience btw. I fell for a complete asshole because he was older and seemed so cool and "rebel" but in the end after a year he turned out to be just that - an asshole. What girls are attracted to are not "assholes" and are not just "nice guys" but rather " strong" guys. Guys they feel safe around, or like they're with someone who has self confidence and can handle himself. For instance, the guy I'm dating now is a complete kindred spirit of mine and the nicest, fluffiest guy in the world - I LOVE it after having dated that jerk for a year - but he also happens to be the kung fu champion of Kuwait and is renowned for his fighting, people are actually afraid of him there. Yet he also takes time out from his full college load to take his mom to movies and buy food for his brothers, what a contradiction! He's definitely nothing like an asshole. I'm not saying you have to become a kung fu master to get a girl, I'm just trying to say that what girls are attracted to is strength and confidence in a guy, and assholes along with superheros both have those two aspects. =) Don't worry love, you'll find that girl for you, I know it's frustrating but I promise you it will happen and you'll be shocked by how easy it works when it's with the right person. ^_^
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Post by radaeron on May 12, 2006 2:29:03 GMT -5
Cheers for the thoughts guys Sure I might rationalise things in a paranoid way. But usually when I set out to a task I like to consider a lot of possible outcomes [Consequentialist ]. And usually I think pretty positively. It's only when it comes to a romancin' and a dancin' it goes paranoid ^__^;; Anyway.. Time to listen to music befitting the scene! *Stroke 9 - Don't Worry* ^__^
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Post by gemma on May 12, 2006 2:54:13 GMT -5
Well, as this thread is for !!Any woman that reads this!!, as being the oldest woman in this thread, lett me tell you I wouldn't kick you outta of my door.
"I hope we can still be friends"
This is a hard thing to explain but CM did the most of the hard job so I just wanna say the followings:
If she wouldn't care about you AT ALL, she wouldn't gave you this "happy sidekick" If we tell a guy this still-friends-thing that means that we still wanna have him, 'cause we appreciate him, like him, he is important to us. And we may feel even guilty a little bit.
And we hope that he will find another girl and we wanna help him in this. When we say still-friends, we offer a shoulder to you.
And a special place in our heart.. MAN, YOU WERE IN LOVE WITH US ----> so there IS a guy on Earth who wanted me, loved me ---> I am a girl, a woman, I feel female!! ---> A MALE WANTED ME!!! (This lifts our self-reliance)
Onto nice-guy theory:
I am old, older than most girls there. (With 25 but I hope Jonna will come here, she is 40 she can add more things than I) We grown-up women have no wish for any badasses.
Mostly a girl adores the assholes because they push the limits. They fight the whole world ---> they are strong, they know their way, they protect girls.
And we like clean things. We have maternal feelings for any assholes, we'd like to clean him out of the dirt, comb his hair, and we hope that after it he will respect us as a Goddess. It's like washing dishes.
But grown-up women (WOMEN NOT GIRLS), have other things in their mind. As for me, I wish a nice guy, a husband, a father for my children, etc.
Time will tell. Don't throw away her friendship. Think after it: you proved her that she is an appetizing female. It will warm his heart.
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Post by liquidchild on May 12, 2006 3:29:35 GMT -5
bit messy had to edit..
Girls go through days with half asmuch sexual thoughts than a guy. Although, thats not important, as you've been involved in spiritual studies. ;D
My two cents, and thats all they are, is that your in an age group of people (I presume your same as me) that is rather radically different from the evolution personality you've chosen. For example, a 20's girl who doesnt know the word spirit (high percentage) will have a completely different value system to you and me.
I so feel for you Rad, I remember when someone uttered the "magic" words to me "lets just be friends". I remember my heart breaking right then and there. hehe
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Post by jeremy on May 12, 2006 5:40:41 GMT -5
I think I'm the exception to most guys because I actually like being told whichever girl I'm asking out wants to stay friends. Unfortunately it's usually the ones that say that who end up being all awkward round me and the ones that pretend not to even care about me that I end up staying friends with. It's ok for me because when I find out the feeling's not mutual I just stop feeling it and get on with being the girl's friend. I've never seen a couple stay madly in love with each other for more than a month, but I've seen couples that periodically return to that state.
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Post by pearldancer on May 12, 2006 16:50:08 GMT -5
Ok, so I wasn't gonna post . . . but as the resident (almost) 30 year old woman. . .. I will just say. . ..I agree with Brenden about the age thing. . . . .though I don't know about the sexual thought bit. Not all of us are so different from you guys. ANYhow, um. .. . er . . .. ahem . .to be fair we DO somehow have this tendancy to get into a strange groove sometimes of thinking about a guy like he is some kind of Ken doll. .. . .a guy yes. .. .but comfortably, anatomically incorrect in our minds. I don't know why we do this . . . but then it seems quite shocking to be reminded that this is not the case. Wish I could be more helpful here but chicks confuse the hell out of me too! ;D As for the whole just friends thing. . . .to my mind it is the most complicated part of the equation .... because it could be given for any number of reasons. To me. .. .that line is as versatile as the word DUDE was in the early nineties. It all depends on 8 million variations of incomprehensible different subtleties. Did I mention that chicks confuse the hell out of me? All I have to say is I admire any guy who has the guts to be legitimatly and truly who he really is. There is so much pressure to the contrary in modern society and I think it is a rare and wonderful thing to see. To all the guys here and Rad to you in particular since it's your turn feeling the pain. .. THANK YOU. . .. from all of us girls. We need you out there changing the world!!! edit: Oh and as for the staying madly in love.... .it IS possible. I have known people who have done so. My great aunt and uncle are like teenagers at 85. I have always been grateful for their example in my life. When you find that one true person. ... the one made for you in the heavens. .. the yang to your yin or yin to your yang. ... that one true twin soul . ... you will know. You will recognize that they have ALWAYS been there . . .this deep, hidden, beautiful piece of your own soul that you have always treasured. When that happens, I promise you, everything you've ever been through in your life will make sense. .. .and be SO worth it. edit again Gee thanks for the edit Brenden Now half my post makes no sense. *giggle n grin* Just kidding. . ..
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